I know some of you are saying, “Please not another Dave Roberts post” I understand. But if you have ideas, write a post and get it to Mark and he will gladly post it. I was going to respond yesterday to Mark’s reference to Bill Shaiken’s article and some of the comments, but then as I usually do, I got long winded and decided to make it blog article. I am not trying to change anyone’s mind. If you do not like Doc, nothing I can say is going to change it. I am simply writing to state why I think Dave Roberts is the perfect manager for the Los Angeles Dodgers, at this time.
Okay, maybe Bill Shaiken was a bit hyperbolic. To say Dave Roberts is the best manager in MLB history in only his 6th season is a little absurd. But just as absurd are the number of arrows Doc finds in his back. Doc makes mistakes just like all managers who have ever managed. Or just like everyone of us in our lives (professional and personal). We are fortunate to not have our lives and decisions on the news/twitter/blog 24/7. Just think about the number of commenters just on this one blog who are upset because of what someone said about their opinion. Do you think they can stand up to the constant ridicule Doc gets?
Doc’s job is to win and not embarrass the organization. And he has done that. He may not have won as many WS as we fans would like, but in his nearly six years, he has won enough games to have the Dodgers in the playoffs every year. What other manager can say that? He has managed the team to the World Series three times winning two (only one counted), and this year yet to be determined. In his six years, no team has a better winning record than LAD. Good players? Yes. But only one MVP (Belli) and two Relievers of the Year (both KJ). No CY. The best pitcher of his generation last won a CY in 2014. CK has had extended stretches on the IL every year Doc has been the manager.
When it is said that Doc is a great communicator, that does not mean to the fans. He is not the LAD Public Relations Director. If you think you need more information on the Dodgers and their players, contact the Public Relations department: Joe Jareck (Director), Jon Chapper (Assistant Director), Juan Dorado (Manger). Tell them how dissatisfied you are with the information coming to the fans. Doc is the LAD manager, and he communicates very well with his team and up the organizational ladder. The team loves him. No, he does not have the personality of Tommy or of Smokey. He is Doc, and he is best suited to manage a team in a sport that is now seemingly run by computer geeks and algorithms.
Doc has made mistakes at very inopportune times in playoff situations. All extremely visible. We all know them. They have been commented on ad nauseum. But how he handled Julio Urias and the rest of the bullpen in the playoffs last year was exceptional. Urias was instrumental in multi-inning closes in Championship clinching Game 7 NLCS against Atlanta and again in WS Game 6 against, TB. He also was exceptional in the clinching Game 3 of the NLDS against SD. He inherited 3 runners in the 2nd inning, stranding all three, while striking out Tatis Jr. on 4 pitches. He pitched a total of 5.0 innings, allowing 1 unearned run in that game. It was a blowout, but not until the 3rd inning AFTER Urias came into the game. The game could have turned with a big hit in that situation. Yes Julio pitched and deserves almost ALL of the credit, but Doc left him in to finish Game 7 and Game 6. So if he deserves blame for leaving CK in Game 5 of 2019 NLDS (and he does), then he deserves credit for leaving Urias in (and he does).
He has done a fantastic job in the first 150 games this year. He managed a team with two starting pitchers for an entire month, and only three for an additional month. He has been without his MVP CF for most of the year. Belli does play and it has not gone unnoticed by the fans. But Doc has not given up on him, and he is not making LAD lose while in the lineup. What if he finds himself before the playoffs? What would a healthy Cody Bellinger do for the lineup? If his struggles continue at playoff time and still plays, you have a legit gripe. Doc was without Seager for 67 games with a broken hand. Betts has been on the IL for lot of season, and has not been himself for most of the time he has been in the lineup.
The Dodgers have used 39 pitchers and 19 different starting pitchers. I acknowledge that many of those were 1.0 IP openers, but nonetheless they were starting because Doc had no one else. The bullpen to start the season was:
Scott Alexander (18 games)
Tony Gonsolin (13 games – 11 starts)
Victor Gonzalez (44 games)
KJ (63 games)
Corey Knebel (23 games)
Jimmy Nelson (28 games)
David Price (35 games – 11 starts)
Blake Treinen (67 games)
Only KJ, Treinen, and Price have remained injury free (knock on wood) this season. Alexander and Nelson are done for the year. Gonzalez will probably not make the playoff roster. And while willing, Price has never really caught on as a reliever. But he is on the roster, so he has to pitch. Is Doc supposed to ignore him? Brusdar Graterol (28 games) is probably not going to make the roster either. Roberts now has help in the form of:
Phil Bickford (51 games)
Joe Kelly (42 games)
Alex Vesia ( 37 games)
Justin Bruihl (15 games)
He has also had to mix and match with Dennis Santana, Andre Jackson, Garrett Cleavenger, Shane Greene, Mitch White, Darrien Nunez, Jake Reed, Evan Phillips, James Sherfy, Neftali Feliz, Yefry Ramirez, Connor Greene, Andrew Vasquez, and Kevin Quackenbush.
Many want to excoriate KJ for the five game stretch (July 18-22) when he blew 3 games, and Doc for putting him in. But since then, KJ has been almost unhittable. 24 games (19 finished) 13 saves and no blown saves, 24.1 IP, 10 hits 4 ER, 8 BB, 32 K, 1.48 ERA. The HR he allowed on Sunday was the first he surrendered since August 4. Yes KJ deserves almost ALL of the credit, but Doc stayed with him, believing he would be needed in October. That is who Doc is. He believes in his players. To a fault? Maybe, but he keeps winning with them.
Last week Mark made a note of the fact that Gabe Kapler used all of his position players and was forced to use Gausman as PH. It was in reference to multiple complaints that Doc has used all of his bench players. But what he has never done, he has not used 26 players in the game. I am still waiting for my fact checker. Hawkeye. to verify. This year, Kapler used all 26 players in a game by the 10th inning. How many here would have ripped Roberts if he had done that. But some of those same people are saying that Kapler is a better manager. Gabe has grown a lot since managing in Philly. He lost the respect and confidence of his team and front office and was fired. He has done a good job with his on the job maturity since being hired by SF, but he too makes mistakes. Nothing was expected of Kapler with the Giants, so he was not managing with a ton of pressure. The team has performed exceptionally well. Doc has never lost the respect and confidence of his team or front office. I am sorry, but fickle fans do not count. He is not responsible for managing your feelings.
If you are looking for perfection, you need to find another sport. Mistakes are made on the field, in the dugout, and in the executive offices.
One more thing, even with Yasiel Puig, Manny Machado, and Trevor Bauer, Doc has never lost the clubhouse. I cannot remember a time the Dodger dugout ever looked like what happened last weekend in SD. You want to see a manager seemingly in over his head? Look at Jayce Tingler. As much of a pain as Puig and Manny were, the Dodgers still got to WS with them. As gifted as Machado is, in his 10 years, he has been to a Championship Series one time and to WS one time, both with the Dodgers and Dave Roberts. It will never be proven, but if Roberts was the SD Manager, IMO that dugout scene would never have happened. Tingler has lost the clubhouse, and his job is in jeopardy. Doc has never lost the clubhouse, he keeps winning, the players have confidence in his leadership, he keeps winning, he will continue to make mistakes, but even so, he keeps winning.
Discussion (29)
Disagree, not disagreeable
How desperate are the Giants for pitching? They are planning on calling up Scott Kazmir to pitch tomorrows game against the Padres. Padres tied the game on Nola HR in the 6th. .
Great article Jeff!
I think Roberts is great in the clubhouse and does a good job keeping players motivated. He is also good with the press and constantly optimistic. And this year to have 96 wins with all of the injuries and distractions requires a lot of creativity and patience. I am often critical of Robert’s in game moves, especially around pitching and manufacturing runs. However, most of those decisions are likely influenced by the preferences of the front office. I would certainly disagree with Shaikin’s opinion that Roberts is the best manager ever, but he has been a solid manager overall,when you consider all facets of the job.
And more importantly, a great win for the Dodgers tonight!
Albert comes through again.
Nice win. The type of game they were losing earlier in the year. I liked Roberts use of the pen tonight. Big moments for Bazooka and Vesia. Kelly is frustrating at times. A pitch clock would affect Kelly. It could help him. Where would they be without Treinen? Probably the one thing this board universally agreed upon was signing him when the A’s let him go.
I’m not sure how Albert was treated in Anaheim. I know Trout thought the world of him but he is absolutely revered in the Dodgers dugout.
Dave made all the right moves in this one
Huge win! Thank you Albert! Could be tied tomorrow! Go Pads!!!!
They get a couple of breaks and tie the game. This umpire sucks big time. His zone is really wide.
Now does Roberts get any credit for not pinch hitting for Urias there?
E-4
It seems Senzatela (remember the last Game vs Dodgers) learned how to pitch Dodgers. Hope the hitters make adjustments
One more setback for Cody.
One more chance for Raley.
DODGERS PLACE CODY BELLINGER ON IL
LOS ANGELES – The Los Angeles Dodgers recalled outfielder Luke Raley and placed infielder/outfielder Cody Bellinger on the injured list with a left rib fracture, retroactive to 9/18.
Raley, 27, returns for his sixth stint with the Dodgers and has appeared in 30 games this season for the Boys in Blue. He is batting .169 on the season with one homer and two RBI. He has spent the majority of the season with Triple-A Oklahoma City and he batted .295 (75-for-254) with 14 doubles, two triples, 18 homers and 66 RBI in 67 games. He has spent parts of five seasons in the minor leagues and he is a .289 hitter with 64 homers and 244 RBI in 414 games. He was acquired by the Dodgers on February 10, 2020 along with right-hander Brusdar Graterol from the Minnesota Twins in exchange for right-hander Kenta Maeda and minor league catcher Jair Camargo.
Bellinger, 26, returns to the injured list for the third time this season and has played in 89 games this year and is batting .159 with nine doubles, nine homers and 34 RBI. The 2019 National League MVP has been with the Dodgers five seasons, batting a combined .257 with 107 doubles, 132 homers and 352 RBI. The 2017 National League Rookie of the Year was originally drafted by the Dodgers in the fourth round of the 2013 First Year Player Draft out of Hamilton High School.
Bellinger removed from the lineup and placed on the 10 day IL retroactive to the 18th. Raley gets the start in RF, Betts moves to CF.
Tnight’s :ineup:
HITTERS H-AB RBI HR SB AVG
M. BettsRF 115-417 54 21 10 .276
C. SeagerSS 87-305 46 10 1 .285
T. Turner2B 173-547 62 22 30 .316
M. Muncy1B 115-456 86 34 2 .252
J. Turner3B 138-496 81 25 2 .278
W. SmithC 103-382 72 25 3 .270
G. LuxLF 74-309 45 7 3 .239
C. BellingerCF 48-302 34 9 2 .159
J. UriasP 10-53 8 0 0 .189
Luix moves up Belli moves down
I to have been critical of Roberts in the past few years. But, this year I’ve relented to the reasoning that he doesn’t make many of the pre or in game decisions. Many mentions of starting Darvish in game 7 and what a bad decision it was after the fact. Darvish failed big time to execute. Now I’m convinced that Roberts had some part in the decision to start Darvish, but it was most likely Farhan or AF who made the final decision to start Darvish. Presently, I feel the front office controls a lot more of what goes on before, during, and after the game. Roberts is a smart baseball guy, but the way he stammers and clichés his way through a press conference is uncomfortable to watch. Like totally scratchy wool uncomfortable.
Dave is a company man and he voices the front office’s proclamations to the press. As mentioned above, Dave’s best asset is creating winning clubhouse environment and supporting his players sometimes to a fault. For doing that the front office handles most of the actual baseball decisions. Is this a fact? No. It’s just a “gut feeling”.
Gran artículo Jeff, estoy de acuerdo con usted sobre la gestión de doc, por ahí me llego a estresar por situaciones del juego que uno pensaría que se hubiese manejado de otra forma, al final solo es la frustración derivada del cariño al equipo, y como mencionó Badger anteriormente, casi siempre tiene a los Dodgers en los primeros lugares.
I think that Roberts is probably the kind of manager that the front office wants. He is willing to take the ideas from all of the analysts, etc. and get buy in from the players. He has convinced the players to sacrifice their personal interests for those of the team, so that the likes of Chris Taylor, Kike Hernandez et al can play all over the field and help the team; he convinces others that they can help by taking fewer at bats, etc. He has seemingly kept the clubhouse focused on winning and that’s very important.
He’s not a great X’s and O’s guy, but I suspect that management doesn’t care about that as much as they do about what he can do.
Wilbert Robinson was 0 – 2 in the World Series as a manager (1916 and 1920). In ’16 they had 2 Hall of Famers as regulars (Zach Wheat and Rube Marquardt). In ’20 they had 3 (Wheat, Marquardt and Burleigh Grimes).
Leo Durocher was 0 – 1 (1941). He had 3 Hall of Famers (Billy Herman, Pee Wee Reese, Joe Medwick) on the roster.
Burt Shotton was 0 – 2 (1947, 1949). He had 2 regulars in the Hall in ’47 (Jackie Robinson and Reese), and 4 in ’49 (Robinson, Reese, Duke Snider and Roy Campanella).
Charlie Dressen was 0 – 2 (1952 and ’53). He had the same 4 Hall of Famers that Shotton did in ’49.
Walter Alston was 4 – 3 in the Series. He won in 1955, ’59, ’63 and ’65 and lost in 1956, ’66 and ’74). In ’55 he had the same 4 Hall of Famers (an amazing run). In ’56 he had the same 4 (although Robinson played a little less) but Don Drysdale got 99 innings and Sandy Koufax got 56. (6 guys in the Hall on the same roster!)
In 1959, he had Snider (in a reduced role) and Koufax and Drysdale. In ’63, it was Koufax and Drysdale – same in ’65. In 1966, add Don Sutton. In 1974, Sutton is the only guy in the Hall.
Tommy Lasorda was 2 – 2 in the Series. In ’77 and ’78, Sutton is the only Hall of Famer. No one from the ’81 squad is in the Hall. Sutton threw 87 ineffective innings in ’88.
I would argue that Alston did more with less than any manager in Dodgers’ history. Those early LA teams mostly couldn’t hit (the ’63 team was the exception). Alston’s teams figured out a way to win when in theory they shouldn’t have. Lasorda took the ultimate underdog team to the title in ’88.
Roberts has had arguably more to work with than any Dodgers teams since the Boys of Summer. He has had great regular season records but has not been brilliant in the post-season. AC and others have reviewed much of the evidence. While Roberts may be as good a post-modern manager as we are going to see, it’s really apples and oranges here. The team’s talent has been as good or better than any era in history (again, except the ’47 – ’56 teams) but the outcomes don’t necessarily show that.
Now here is the epitome of irony. A.J. Preller is firing the Padres Farm Director, Sam Geaney, effective immediately. Preller empties his farm system and then has the nerve to tell the Farm Director the farm system is not good enough? Geaney built the farm system so Preller could destroy it, and now it’s Geaney’s fault that the farm system needs to improve. Genius. I hope Peter Seidler agrees with Preller and keeps him. What the heck, keep Tingler too. It’s all the Farm Director’s fault.
Just ordered a 2021 Albert Pujols card where he is in Dodger Blue. Scherzer and Turner cards are available too. But all are a little pricey right now.
Just read, though maybe someone posted yesterday late that I did not see.
Jo Lasorda passed away at 91 late yesterday.
RIP ma’am and condolences to friends and family.
cheers
pb+
That didn’t take long…
“Now, I will admit that Doc is better now than he was in 2017. And I constantly hope that he’ll keep improving and not let us down. He’s the Kenley Jansen of managers. Overall his stats are great, but he chooses inopportune time to screw things up.
Hang the mirror back on the wall B&P and no carpet farming…
Today’s LA Times talks about Scherzer and his perception of the Dodgers clubhouse. Doc creates an environment stars can thrive in, a clubhouse they wish to join. Keep winning Dodgers and I wish flaciddity for the Giants.
I think that Roberts has done a rather good job this year, specifically in terms of handling his depleted at times pitching staff. I do not see any reason to call him a great manager in his sixth season, with the best talent in the league in the last five seasons. It is to his credit that the clubhouse is handled so well, though part of that is the kind of players the Dodgers’ hierarchy chooses to sign.
I don’t see why anyone would want to term Roberts a great or even pretty good strategical manager. All managers get second-guessed, of course. All managers, particularly of the Dodgers, get a lot of support from the broadcasters and writers. The Dodgers rarely fire anybody, they did not even fire Mattingly, they said a bunch of things about how they expected to keep him , but then they discussed things, and he decided to move on, etc., whatever that means.
So I expect that Roberts would not get fired no matter what he does or doesn’t do, in the next ten or twenty seasons. Just like Alston and Lasorda were never getting fired, even though Lasorda’s record was under .500 cumulatively in his last ten seasons. Compare that with Stengel being pushed out. Torre being insulted by the offer or a minimal contract which they knew he would not take, and Girardi being fired. Francona was fired, I think that LaRussa may have been somewhere. Most managers get fired, much less so in Los Angeles. Public relations is a very important thing here, winning titles perhaps not so much, as we have one title in the last 33 seasons. Actually, since 1965, we have won one title in a full season, that being in 1988.
Some of us think that there is enough talent here, as compared to other teams in our league, and all of baseball, to win more titles, with a really good manager. No one can prove that either way, but when the Yankees had the most talent, they won most of the titles. Boston has multiple titles in the last twenty years, so do the Giants. How do the Giants have three, and we have one? Bad luck? Roberts is the best manager of all time , with one title, in a 60-game regular season? Only in L.A., would someone write that. The more demanding fans here are of the Lakers and USC football. not the Dodgers. The Dodgers are right now the betting favorite to win the title, and substantially the favorite to win the pennant. Does that seem reasonable? If they do not, is Roberts still the greatest manager in baseball history? If he does, he will be impervious to criticism, although Torre, Stengel, Scioscia, Murtaugh, Cox, Francona, among others, were not. Some people seem to think that it is a form of sacrilege to criticize a Dodgers manager
Just checked the matchups for tonights game in Denver, which by the way will be played in chilly weather. Temps have dropped into the 50’s here today, which means it could be in the 40’s up there tonight. 5 Dodgers hitting over .400 against Senzatela. Two Rockies have good numbers off of Urias. Will Smith is hitting .061 against Senzatela, Barnes .200. If Dave plays the numbers, Smitty sits. McMahon and Hampson have homered off of Urias, Bellinger, Betts(2), Muncy, Seager (3) and Taylor have homered off of Senzatela. Lux has a .455 avg in 11 AB’s. Muncy is only hitting .176 off of him in 17 at bats. I can’t watch the game, so I will listen to the radio feed. Watched NCIS’s first episode of the new season last night. Gibbs is back. NCIS is much better with Harmon on every week. The Hawaii one was meh. Too slow developing the story line and took too much time developing the characters. Checked the Denver weather a minute ago. 82 % chance of rain. Temp at game time around 60. Dropping into the 40’s.
Nice write up on Dave Roberts, Jeff. He does a good job of managing a group of all star players, not an easy task. He takes a big picture approach. Yes, he has incredible talent, but there are no guarantees that will translate into a championship team. Counting 2017, the Dodgers should have won two series during his stint. Okay, I would have started Clayton Kershaw and not Yu Darvish in the 7th game and not used Brandon Morrow in game five. Yes, there was Rich Hill getting pulled early, definitely a miscommunication.
But hey, stuff happens. You make a decision and it either works or doesn’t. One was strictly a communication issue between Roberts and Hill. The other two were bad “gut” choices. Of the two, I really hated the Yu decision most. Hated it before the game, even more after. Just believed, a sense more or less, that he was going to be a disaster.
Just something I find interesting. But the Cal League implemented a pitch clock mid-season. The results have been impressive, shortening games on average 21 minutes. Apparently everyone likes it. Speeds up games. Need to implement in MLB in 2022. Games are simply too long. Orel had high praise for it, thinking it would improve the game at the major league level. Pitch clock and DH, eliminate extreme shifts, now we’re talking.
The Gold Standard you mentioned was .500 in the post season. He was .526 as a manager. 8 Division titles in 20 years. Roberts is .585 in post season and .619 in regular season and has 5 Division titles in 5 years. If Lasorda is the Gold Standard Roberts must be Rhodium standard. Or maybe Palladium because on someone else’s list there will be another greatest of all time.
“Let the attacks and insults begin”. You’ve come to expect them haven’t you. I believe you ended another rant that way recently.
It’s true Roberts has had some great teams. If you have the most money you usually have the best toys. He’s driven his Ferrari’s to the head of the pack every year. It’s easy to point out a few wtf moments in his career. Every manager has them. But, I’m fine with him. I don’t watch him much, I watch the players.
Bravo Jeff. I love your stuff. The voice of reason in the midst of chaos. In all honesty, I have never had a favorite manager. But I have slung arrows at them when I believed they screwed the pooch. But having never played or managed in the bigs, I can only look at their performance from the eyes of a fan. And as a fan, my vision is often blurred by my passion for the team and my hopes of them winning. I can still be watching TV and when they fail to execute in a clutch situation, get a sick feeling in my stomach that they are letting it slip away. This year has been painful in a lot of ways. The expectations at the beginning were so high. And the team came out of the gate hitting on all cylinders except for Bellinger going down after 4 games. But then came that 5-15 stretch where it seemed nothing went right. But they have battled back from 5 down to be 1 back with 12 to play. They need to win and put pressure on the Giants who really have not felt much. You can go back through the years and find places where every manager made a huge blunder in a big game. But it is still on the player to perform. In 51, Dressen chose to send Branca in to face Thompson, forgetting that Thompson had homered off of him earlier in the playoffs. And he made that decision because the bullpen coach told him Erskine had bounced a curveball in the dirt while warming up. 62, Smokey first sending a gassed Roebuck out to pitch the 9th with the meat of the Giants order coming up. Ignoring pleas from both Don Drysdale and Duke Snider to let Big D pitch the 9th. In the 80’s Lasorda choosing to pitch to Jack Clark rather than walk him and face Van Slyke who was hitting under .100 in the series at that point.
Dave choosing Darvish to start was a bad decision. Wood was rested and fresh and had totally baffled the Astros in his first start. But you can play that what if game all day long. Roberts is the manager of the Dodgers. According to his contract he will remain so for the next few years.
It’s funny how people remember things differently. Don Mattingly’s Dodgers not stealing bases is one of them. In 2014, the second to last year that the Donny managed the Dodgers, the team stole 138 bases, good for second in the league.
No manager has more apologists than Dave Roberts. It’s understandable due to his lofty record while managing super teams. “He has managed the team to the World Series three times winning two (only one counted)” is a prime example. But, he would have 2 non-imaginary WS titles if he didn’t do these things against the Astros…
Pull Rich Hill after 4 innings in Game 2
Used Brandon Morrow in Game 5 (after using him in the previous 4 games. After never allowing him to pitch 3 games in a row up until that point.
Used Yu Darvish in game 7 when he had Woody and Clayton available.
Another example “When it is said that Doc is a great communicator, that does not mean to the fans. ” What does this even mean? If you’re a great communicator, you can communicate greatly to the players, but to no one else? How about the other Rich Hill incident when Doc went to mound to check on him and Hill thought he was getting pulled and walked off the mound? Another early pull and another loss in a critical postseason game. A critical miscommunication for a great communicator.
As I’ve said before, this won’t be settled until he managers teams that aren’t as stacked as his current run. Once again, I’ll point to the Gold Standard. Tommy was the underdog on all 4 WS appearances and his Olympic team was also an underdog. We know the results. He was also 3-1 as the All-Star manager.
Now, I will admit that Doc is better now than he was in 2017. And I constantly hope that he’ll keep improving and not let us down. He’s the Kenley Jansen of managers. Overall his stats are great, but he chooses inopportune time to screw things up.
Let the attacks and insults begin…
Great work Jeff!!! I’m sure many of today’s comments will remind me of that classic line from A Few Good Men, “You Can’t Handle The Truth”…
I hope next year, God willing, when I meander to the back fields at Camelback I’ll see a Learn How To Bunt area!??!
Is this asking too much from these millionaires or their agents??
Go Blue…Rock n Roll…
I still hate playing in the Mile High aberration…
Amen! The Clubhouse!
That is what I disliked about Mattingly. The Clubhouse was a circus and Donnie Ballgame just did not know what to do.