Boston Still Needs to Win One More

Since August 1st, what Dodger has the highest batting average?

I do not think Doc will be fired either. The Dodgers only have one way to score. There should be many ways to score. Do not put all of your eggs in one basket. We do not run and hit, we do not steal any bases, we do not move runners over from second, we do not take what the other team will give us. It is a HR, walk or a SO.

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Doc loves some balllayers more than others. Doc loves Joc. He gave him three years to make it. Finally this year he has been pretty good. Still cannot hit left handlers, but he has never been given a chance. He likes Dozier and he should not even be on this team. Doc does not appreciate Freese, Hill, Verdugo or Toles.

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I absolutely hate his righty lefty line ups. Strictly metrics. Soc does not see what is in front of his eyes. In my opinion, Bellinger, Muncey and Puig shoul be in the line up every day

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I think FAZ has done a lot of good things. However, they certainly do not value a good bull pen. They certainly do not value good contact hitters. They certainly do not value small ball. It is sad, but if FAZ and Doc do not make changes in the way they do things, we will have the same problem next year.

In my opinion, the Dodgers are already the big winners this year even if they don’t win the world series… since they accomplished their main goal of staying under the Luxury Tax Threshold.

I hope they have t-shirts printed up to acknowledge this fact so I can pick one up at my local Dick’s Sporting Goods.

Freeze

Turner

Kike

Manny

Muncy

Puig

Taylor

Barnes

Kershaw

Still numb. Did I really witness that debacle last night.

That will go down as one of the worst defeats of all time.

Instead of looking forward to a massive game tonight, the whole thing has gone flat.

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MJ

You have had this team and management nailed for a long time, like others on here, and I feel your pain.

It makes it doubly hard because you havnt second guessed this.

I didn’t get home from the game until early this morning and I just got home from church so this is the first opportunity that I have had to post some observation from the game.

-Beautiful night, great crowd, lots of Boston fans, place was rocking, $60 to park, park is beautiful, good seats, Dodger dogs…. The game—No one around us could figure out Robert’s moves. Lots of complaining about the “stupid” things he did. Hill was going great and didn’t appear to want to be removed even tho he told Roberts to “watch me”. Why take out a left hander who had given up only one hit to bring in a (unreliable) left hander to face a left hander????

On the radio show after the game that was the big question and Roberts didn’t answer it very well. Alexander did what he seems to have done often lately – 4 balls and none close. Then comes Madson who had said that he felt tired and his arm was worn out. He has pitched in almost all of our postseason games

You should have seen Puig when the home run sailed over his head. You could tell he was mad by his posture and hands on hips. Then when the inning was over, he slowly walked to the dugout while everyone else ran off the field. He was, by far, the last to the dugout and didn’t look happy.

Jansen was the only one warming up in the bullpen and when we saw that, and that it was only the 8th, we were really worried as was everyone around us.

No one could understand why Baez and Uries were unavailable when they both threw fewer pitches on Friday that Jansen did. When Jansen came in we all said we were expecting bad things to happen. I can understand not wanting to pitch Uries, but holding Baez back in a must win game didn’t seem to make sense. Seems like it should have Baez in 8th and Jansen in 9th.

As we were walking out of the stadium there was only one topic of conversation, Robert’s strange decisions. As Mark said, we also talked about every one of Robert’s decisions backfired, nothing went right and the difficult thing is that they were all questionable decisions anyway. On the post-game talk show all of the callers complained about the pitching changes. Roberts had weak explanations about what he did, and when they asked Hill about the decision he avoided answering the question.

We came to the conclusion that if this were the first time that something like this happened, Roberts gets the benefit of the doubt, but this has happened over and over, last year too, and he needs to be held responsible.

We can complain about FAZ, hitters approach these days, etc. but the fact of the matter is this-Dave Roberts lost that game tonight. Those who complain about his over managing have done it all year long. This isn’t a hindsight deal. Pulling Hill last year was debatable but if Kenley hits his target against Gonzalez it doesn’t matter. The Dodgers win the WS last year. There is really nothing to debate last night. He pulled a pitcher rolling and who is left-handed to bring in another lefty to pitch to a left-handed batter. It’s dumber than anything I’ve ever seen. If you felt Hill was tiring the you let him pitch to Holt then get him out. There is absolutely nothing defensible about what took place last night.

The peeps that are part of the Hedge Fund that own the team. It’s their frikin money and that is what runs this organization. Note I didn’t say team. $$$$ is what is running this organization.

OK, a lot of what I read is total BS and opinion. But here is what we do know:

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1. Last night’s game was a must win game and the Dodgers were in a position to win.

2. Rich Hill seldom pitches into the 7th inning.

3. Rich Hill can lose it quickly! That’s a fact

4. Rich Hill was tiring – he told Doc that. How long he could go was debatable, 6? 7? Maybe. Maybe not!

5. I would have absolutely taken Hill out…. at the end of the 6th inning and brought in Clayton to pitch the 7th and 8th.

6. Clayton was going to pitch today, so he could pitch two innings last night.

7. We know that Kenley likes to give up a long ball or two, so save him for the 9th and the Dodgers win game 4 by a 4-1 or 4-2 margin.

8. Worry about the game in front of you, which was last night. Then pitch Ryu tonight – he’s better in Dodger stadium anyway.

9. Kershaw goes in game 6. That makes the most sense!

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That’s what should have happend. Alexander, Baez (not available), Madson, Wood, Maeda, Flora and all that – NO! They would have all been ready tonight in a tied series. The mistake was taking out Hill too late!

I hope Mark Walter (perennial bridesmaid) is shown the door.

I hope Mark Walter sees the light and makes the appropriate changes, what ever those may be.

They key line from what Mitchell wrote is essentially what I have posted:

“But here’s the thing for everyone calling for Roberts to be fired immediately. Roberts gets a lot of his marching orders from the front office. A lot of “Here’s what should be done in this scenario, and in this scenario …” A new manager is not going to change things that much. So please direct some of your anger to Andrew Friedman and Farhan Zaidi.”

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Roberts does what the Braintrust wants him to, so why would they fire him?

While I totally disagree with Doc making the early move to get Hill, I didn’t realize that Baez and Urias were not available because of the night before. That really limits Roberts options in that situation. The no brainer would be Baez, but with that bullet burned the night before, you either have Floro or Madsen. Pick your poison. Let’s not forget, this is the same bullpen that went 8 scoreless innings the night before, and outpitched the Brewers. If any of those guys does his job last night, we are looking at a 2-2 series. Like I have posted before, and they have said time and time again, both J Hair and Nomah have stressed that there is no excuses in the World Series, you have to make that pitch and throw strikes right out of the gate when you are a reliever. We haven’t for some reason, in the keyest of situations, and it is killing us. Also, win or lose, FAZ aren’t arrogant or dumbasses, they tend to learn a little bit every year. I would bet my bottom dollar you will see more contact hitters in the line up next year along with some bona fide relievers. With that said, there is still a season to salvage. Let’s put our Dodger colors on and root for Kershaw to get it done tonight, one inning at time, one game at a time. We ain’t done yet.

From Houston Mitchell (LA Times) – Link to full article below

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It’s one thing if the Dodgers get beat because the other team outplays them. It’s an entirely different matter for the Dodgers to get beat because the manager and the front office can’t lift their heads out of their laptops long enough to pay attention to what is going on.

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I love analytics. They are extremely useful and I would rely on them heavily if I was running a team. But you have to wake up and pay attention. Madson himself said his pitches weren’t behaving like they should. The computer doesn’t know that. But a manager should. He should pay close attention to what the numbers tell him, but he should also pay some attention to what his own pitchers tell him.

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I don’t blame him for bringing Jansen in for the eighth. He’s your closer, and though he has been erratic, he is still a top closer. And even if Baez came into the game in the eighth, that just means Jansen probably gives up the homer in the ninth.

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This game, and yes, probably this series, was lost with the indefensible decision to remove Rich Hill. Just like Game 2 in last year’s World Series.

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But here’s the thing for everyone calling for Roberts to be fired immediately. Roberts gets a lot of his marching orders from the front office. A lot of “Here’s what should be done in this scenario, and in this scenario …” A new manager is not going to change things that much. So please direct some of your anger to Andrew Friedman and Farhan Zaidi.

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They can all share the blame for the Game 4 loss. Maybe their computers can tell them what percentage blame each person should receive.

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By the way, after the game even the Red Sox were saying how relieved they were that Hill was removed.

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On a different note, who’s ready for some sports in LA today? Your options?

Kings at Staples Center at 12:30pm

Rams at the Coleseum 1:15pm

Galaxy at Stubhub Center 1:30pm

Ducks at the Pond at 5pm

Dodgers at Dodger Stadium 5pm

Clippers at Staples Center 6:30pm

Phil Collins at the Forum at 8pm (That is where I”ll be!)

I love the Dodgers, but I sincerely believe we are looking at Boston as the best team in baseball versus L.A. as the 4th best team, in MLB. I think it’s time to look forward to the offseason and possible improvements to the team.

There’s no telling what the free agent results will be, but I would target Bryce Harper, D.J. LeMahieu and Patrick Corbin. With the Dodgers below the luxury tax threshold, they should go all in for these guys. Corbin is important because I think Kershaw exercises his option.

The next thing I’d do is work out a trade with Miami for J.T. Realmuto and let Yasmani walk. I think a deal involving Puig, Will Smith and Dennis Santana may be enough to entice Jeter.

The rest of the offseason would be spent building a bullpen from free agents, trades and spare parts. One of FAZ’s Muncy type finds would be great. Perhaps spending more to get one of the solid relievers on the market would also be worth it.

The basic roster would then look something like this:

1B – Muncy

2B – LeMahieu

SS – Seager

3B – Turner

C – Realmuto

LF – Verdugo

CF – Bellinger

RF – Harper

SP – Beuhler

SP – Corbin

SP – Ryu or Kershaw (If one of them doesn’t go anywhere)

SP – Hill or Wood

SP – Urias

It all up to the puppet masters if Roberts stays or goes.

Roberts continually over manages and has no idea how to use his players. He should not have pulled Buehler in game three ( screw the pitch count) and Hill in game four. Baez is the hot hand right now and should be the next in when the game is close. And for God’s sake how about giving the bunt sign when the shift is on. Runners on base put pressure on the pitcher. And while I’m at it could we steal a base once in a while. Would like to see Roberts replaced with someone who has some baseball instincts.

Unavailable and Tired in a must win game are words that should never come into play in a must win game with your season on the line. Those are loser mentality words, for 2nd place teams. That being said I will say their is probably a 2% chance we can win 3 in a row and I will hold onto that.

Screw Dave Roberts. Apparently, Hill told him to watch him in the 7th. Hill should have told Roberts to go back in the clubhouse and open an Oregon Pinot Noir and stay there until they win the game. Roberts just can’t leave well enough alone. What is saving Hill for? Roberts probably doesn’t realize Hill won’t need to pitch again this season. All the momentum we had going into this game, Roberts pissed away with removing Hill. And, for Alexander? And, then Madsen? Roberts just can’t help himself. And, his bullshit explanations after the game are just laughable. As I have stated in the past, leave the starter in until they actually prove they aren’t effective anymore. Roberts lost us the world series last year when he pulled Hill too soon and ruined the BP the rest of the series.

As a Dodger fan for 60 years I’m done until they get rid of Roberts. He has proved time and time again he doesn’t have the ability to manage a lineup or pitching staff. Again, screw Dave Roberts. And, there is no way we win this world series with this collection manager and under achieving players.

Back to back losses in the World Series do not necessarily cost a manager his job – Tommy kept his after ’77-78 and got wins in ’81 and ’88. Charlie Dressen lost his job after losses in ’52-53 for other reasons (he wanted a multi-year contract). It’s the “why” that matters. The “why” is the reason that Roberts keeps his job.

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I agree with everything that AC posted above. It’s what I have called the structural defects in how this Dodgers roster has been constructed. The roster construction, which is based on what the Braintrust views as the best way to win, makes several assumptions:

1 – Home runs are the best and most efficient way to score runs, so stock your roster with HR hitters and tell them to try for a bomb every time up

2 – Relievers are fungible and with a few exceptions are inconsistent from year to year so build your bullpen on the fly each year. You can find enough minor league free agents, AAAA starters and young guys to cobble a bullpen together.

3 – Depth is really important. It’s better to have 2 guys (preferably position players in a platoon) for every position then it is to have big stars.

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The “why” of Roberts keeping his job is that he has managed the roster assembled by the Braintrust the way that they wanted it managed. Platoon almost everyone, yank your starting pitchers early and then focus on match-ups, emphasize scoring by the HR, etc. Why would the Braintrust fire Roberts when he has done exactly what they have asked?

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No – this Series loss is on the ‘Trust. And I don’t see the big tear down that others here have suggested will happen. There will be changes behind the plate, there may be outfielders moved due to the glut, to get the payroll down and bring Verdugo or Toles up, and there will be a change or 2 in the rotation. We will have a mostly new bullpen again as we do, every year. But – the Dodgers have made it to the World Series in consecutive seasons and the Braintrust will not construct the roster differently as this will be viewed as a success.

That was such an epic meltdown I could not even comment until now. Every single pitcher Doc called upon was tagged for at least 1 run, hindsight is 20/20 but Hill should have stayed in with a 4 run lead and pitch out of it. The hitters also failed to rise to the moment but why hit for Freese with Dozier? Why hit for Barnes with Grandal? I am not sure if it’s desperation or insanity to do the same things over and over. There is a path to a 3 game comeback: 1st Kershaw puts the team on his back and the hitters give him run support and head back to Boston. 2nd pitch Buehler on 3 days rest and go as far as he can to win game 6. 3rd use Ryu for 3, Hill for 3 or 4 then all hands on deck for a wild game 7. Teams have done it in the past but having to sweep 2 in Boston is a tall order if they even make it back to Boston. But it starts with today and I will root for Clayton and the team to rally in the last Dodger home game of the 2018 season and hope the Sox are not celebrating on our field.

They will not get rid of Roberts. They hired him and are going to admit a mistake was made. They point out the division titles, 2 World Series appearances blah blah blah. I agree that is impressive and the players respect and love him I guess so I hear. But, I think the players can be too comfortable and I don’t understand how you can respect a guy who continuously makes moves that get you beat. I would think the players would be upset about that. Roberts has had great success and when he was first hired he would show urgency to win. Now he doesn’t give his team the best chance to win. A comparison might be when Kinsler made his error Cora didn’t publicly attack him he sent the message by playing holt and how did that work out? But Roberts lets Madson fail over and over. You could say none of the rest did well but he never tried his hottest reliever in Baez but Cora did with Kelley. Although I don’t minimize the success Roberts has had what quality managers could not have taken the talent he has been given and been successful. I would say goodbye to Grandal, Kershaw, Maeda, wood, Jansen, ryu, and anybody and everybody that can improve this team.

Last night was one of the bitterest losses I have experienced. EVERY SINGLE MOVE DOC MADE WAS WRONG! When that happens, you can’t put it all on the manager. The pitchers (after Hill) simply did not execute. Boston fans were outraged that Cora left Rodriguez in the game because of what happened, but Boston came back. I was not ready to see Hill come out, but I have seen Rich Hill “lose it” very quickly. Should Doc have allowed Hill one more batter? Two more? We know what happened because we saw it. We have no idea what might have happend because he took Hill out.

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It was obvious Alexander could not find the plate, but Madson? That’s the biggest blunder I see. He has allowed every inherited runner to score and Doc knows that. That was not a smart move. Then every pitcher who came in could not execute, including their closer.

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David Price fixed his playoff choking. Clayton and Kenley have not! I think the series is over and I look for Clayton to be sent to the showers early. However, simply losing two World Series in a row has to cost Dave Roberts his job.

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I think there will be big changes… especially after the Dodgers stayed under the Luxury Tax and it will be reset. You will see them go after a few bullpen arms next year and there are several in the system they may bring up.

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If Kershaw opts out… so be it – no more offers. It was a great run, Clayton – we will never forget you. MOVE ON! Turn the page!

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Kenley’s health may be a problem, but you can’t count on him. I would have never re-signed him and I said so at the time. I thought that with Wood, Maeda, Urias and others, heh bullpen would be strength. Boston and Milwaukee and Houston used starters as relievers with success… why can’t the Dodgers? Wood and his lack of velocity and Maeda with his silly smirk should be gone.

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New manager, New Ace, Goodbye Clayton, New Closer, Goodbye Kenley (who takes him?), New Bullpen, Goodbye Ryu, New catcher (and it ain’t Barnes), Seager back and get rid of the all-or-nothing swingers. Rich Hill has one final year. I would try for Eovaldi if the cost is not stupid.

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Rotation:

1. Buehler

2. Eovaldi

3. Urias

4. Hill

5. Gonsolin

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In reality, Doc may not be the biggest problem, but two straight WS loses costs you your job!

Not be bad wish Roberts catches the flu bug can’t get out of bed Dodgers win today Roberts admitted to the hospital does not make the flight to Boston green manager of the Dodgers for game 6 and 7 and the Dodgers win the World Series big birthday wish.